『太陽誘電』専用スレ その20スピンドルat CDR
『太陽誘電』専用スレ その20スピンドル - 暇つぶし2ch196:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/06/25 13:18:18 hh/tLn6V
2008/06/25(水) 13:16:38 ID:hh/tLn6V
/06/25(水) 13:10:17 ID:hh/tLn6V
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197:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/06/25 13:23:00 hh/tLn6V
:2008/06/25(水) 13:18:18 ID:hh/tLn6V
2008/06/25(水) 13:16:38 ID:hh/tLn6V
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198:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/06/25 18:43:25 tUsI5yxc
ケーズで50枚スピトンドルの訳あり品が300円でワゴンに置かれてたので買っちまった。
外装にヒビが入ってるだけで中身普通\(^o^)/

199:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/06/25 19:50:06 dIsi8kVW
99999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
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200:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/06/25 19:51:25 dIsi8kVW
99999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
99999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
99999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
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9999999999999999999999999999999999

















9

201:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/06/26 00:43:36 sUeIoY8L
>>198
300円は安いな

202:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/06/27 00:37:15 H88avP7e
初めて雷豚ドライブ買ったんで計測してみたけど、ひどいな。
5年前に焼いたTYG01の方が焼きたてのTYG03よりエラー少ないってどういうことだよw

203:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/06/27 01:22:10 VyjUa/u+
ライトオンを買うからあかんのちゃう?w

204:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/06/27 08:33:31 7U1gA/X/
>>203
ソレダ!m9(・∀・)

205:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/06/27 10:56:51 4Y8j/gFS
ライトオン!

206:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/06/27 15:05:14 vqxwF7YQ
荒らしてるのは誰?

207:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/06/27 21:56:00 IKZA6Up1
-Rの品質どんどん落ちてない?
ハードディスクも500G7000円くらいまで落ちてきてるし、そっちに移行しようかなぁ…。記録も楽だし

208:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/06/28 03:19:03 KWOI5y6O
価格もどんどん落ちてるじゃん。

209:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/06/28 09:28:59 KapYoNHd
>>207
利便性考えるとHDDに移行するのもひとつの手だけど
データ保護に関するリスクが光学メディアとは別の次元になるから、その辺考えてね

210:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/06/29 04:53:37 +js7NjWb
BDならセルビデオも見れるお!

211:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/06/29 06:39:25 fdpuuBi5
昨日買ったDVD-Rを焼こうと思ってよく見たらCD-Rだったw
間違えて買った俺アホスwww

雨降ってんのに交換行くのマンドクセ('A`)


212:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/06/30 14:12:30 PqJ6NLxV
99999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
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213:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/06/30 14:13:23 PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/25(水) 13:23:00 ID:hh/tLn6V
:2008/06/25(水) 13:18:18 ID:hh/tLn6V
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214:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/06/30 14:13:58 PqJ6NLxV
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215:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/06/30 14:14:25 PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:13:58 ID:PqJ6NLxV
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2008/06/25(水) 13:23:00 ID:hh/tLn6V
:2008/06/25(水) 13:18:18 ID:hh/tLn6V
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216:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/06/30 14:14:52 PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:14:25 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:13:58 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:13:23 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/25(水) 13:23:00 ID:hh/tLn6V
:2008/06/25(水) 13:18:18 ID:hh/tLn6V
2008/06/25(水) 13:16:38 ID:hh/tLn6V
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217:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/01 00:45:32 BtdvjL/Z
>>211
あるあ・・・ねーよ!w

218:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/01 06:16:33 nX8J56hq
この荒らしはどういうやつ?

219:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/01 15:21:01 vGM6F9h2
>>218
何回規制されても懲りない常連の池沼

220:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/01 21:10:55 uyK3+8Li
>>207
うちはとっくに光学から手を引いたよ。
ブルーレイでも容量少なくて使えなさ過ぎる上に、記録品質がお粗末過ぎる。

221:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/02 10:44:43 sCIxUWkp
424 :名無しさん┃】【┃Dolby:2008/07/02(水) 08:31:10 ID:bMkzSVZw0
>>376
うお、オレが適当にからかったら何か深夜に愉快な事に成ってたんだな。

まあ、散々指摘されてるが、HDDなんで普通に突然死するぞ。電源入れたらスピンドルが
回らなかったり、突然カンカン言い出したり...。そもそも、樹脂素材に記録層を挟んだ
だけのものより、メディアと複雑な機械と電気回路を組み合わせたものの方を信頼するって
のがどうかしてる。
スレリンク(av板:424番)

222:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/03 02:22:57 6r6Su+t2
-RだろうがHDDだろうが、データを多重化しない奴は結局泣くよ。

223:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/04 09:35:56 wgatGbDM
焼いても見ない奴がほとんどだろ?
二度と見ないんだから焼き品質がどうとか、どうでもよくね?

224:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/04 11:28:56 adbAgWym
お前はどうしていつもいつも本気になりきれないんだ?どうせとかどうでもとかほんと後ろ向きだな
いつになったら本気になるの?

225:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/05 00:43:03 uLOosWa5
2008/06/30(月) 14:14:52 ID:PqJ6NLxV
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2008/06/30(月) 14:13:58 ID:PqJ6NLxV
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2008/06/25(水) 13:23:00 ID:hh/tLn6V
:2008/06/25(水) 13:18:18 ID:hh/tLn6V
2008/06/25(水) 13:16:38 ID:hh/tLn6V
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226:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/05 00:43:26 uLOosWa5
2008/07/05(土) 00:43:03 ID:uLOosWa5
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2008/06/25(水) 13:23:00 ID:hh/tLn6V
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227:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/05 00:44:10 uLOosWa5
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2008/06/25(水) 13:23:00 ID:hh/tLn6V
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228:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/05 00:45:31 uLOosWa5
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2008/06/25(水) 13:23:00 ID:hh/tLn6V
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229:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/05 00:46:02 uLOosWa5
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230:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/05 00:51:43 sY2vTbpg
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231:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/05 00:52:05 sY2vTbpg
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2008/07/05(土) 00:43:03 ID:uLOosWa5
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2008/06/25(水) 13:23:00 ID:hh/tLn6V
:2008/06/25(水) 13:18:18 ID:hh/tLn6V
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232:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/05 08:26:50 REmZdF9j
何やってんの?

233:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/05 09:08:25 REmZdF9j
全然メッセージが伝わって来ない。
荒らしの目的は?

234:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/05 11:08:08 2i8wtfDt
僕は頭がおかしいキチガイですって言いたいんだと思うよ。

235:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/05 22:12:02 ImG1LRgZ
これはサンマイワシ森光博の荒らしより酷いですな

236:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/05 23:10:06 n5yGG/Sp
BDってドライブもメディアも単価が高杉
普及価格帯に降りてくるまであと何年かかるかわからんし

237:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/06 08:47:39 N2ZAHb/j
DVDやCD-Rもそうだったんだから

238:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/06 10:43:35 obQ2AlTY
CD-Rも出始めはクソ高かったよなw

239:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/06 16:41:25 TXDITt28
今の誘電傷多過ぎ。どうなってるんだ。

240:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/06 17:44:08 JnA5GL3r
工場から店頭に並ぶまでの段階で傷が出来るのでは?
運送会社社員やショップ店員って結構品物を雑に扱って
いるところを時々見かけるし・・・。

241:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/06 18:29:18 CQLYbTso
工場から店頭までの扱いが以前と変わってるとも思えないなあ
昔から雑だろ

242:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/06 21:36:41 Mbc9F7qY
細かい傷が外周に付いているのがほとんどだから
搬送時の傷ではないんじゃないか

243:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/06 22:25:05 obQ2AlTY
おれ、すげーことおもいついた
記録面下にしてスピンドルケースに入れるから傷つくんじゃね?
記録面を上にして重ねれば傷つかない
やべ、特許おさえなきゃマネされる!

244:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/06 22:38:45 CQLYbTso
以前あった流れ星はなくなったがこれでは・・・

245:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/07 08:29:22 cqybte76
上も下も関係ねえべ

246:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/07 13:43:47 OjV3MtiG
:2008/07/05(土) 00:52:05 ID:sY2vTbpg
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247:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/07 13:45:52 OjV3MtiG
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:2008/06/25(水) 13:18:18 ID:hh/tLn6V
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248:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/07 13:48:29 OjV3MtiG
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:2008/07/05(土) 00:52:05 ID:sY2vTbpg
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:2008/06/25(水) 13:18:18 ID:hh/tLn6V
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249:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/07 13:50:49 OjV3MtiG
2008/07/07(月) 13:43:47 ID:OjV3MtiG
:2008/07/05(土) 00:52:05 ID:sY2vTbpg
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:2008/06/25(水) 13:18:18 ID:hh/tLn6V
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250:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/07 13:53:00 OjV3MtiG
2008/07/07(月) 13:43:47 ID:OjV3MtiG
:2008/07/05(土) 00:52:05 ID:sY2vTbpg
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2008/06/30(月) 14:14:52 ID:PqJ6NLxV
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:2008/06/25(水) 13:18:18 ID:hh/tLn6V
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251:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/07 14:13:16 OjV3MtiG
2008/07/07(月) 13:43:47 ID:OjV3MtiG
:2008/07/05(土) 00:52:05 ID:sY2vTbpg
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:2008/07/05(土) 00:44:10 ID:uLOosWa5
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2008/06/30(月) 14:14:52 ID:PqJ6NLxV
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:2008/06/25(水) 13:18:18 ID:hh/tLn6V
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252:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/07 14:22:52 OjV3MtiG
2008/07/07(月) 13:43:47 ID:OjV3MtiG
:2008/07/05(土) 00:52:05 ID:sY2vTbpg
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:2008/07/05(土) 00:44:10 ID:uLOosWa5
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2008/06/25(水) 13:23:00 ID:hh/tLn6V
:2008/06/25(水) 13:18:18 ID:hh/tLn6V
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253:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/07 14:25:55 OjV3MtiG
2008/07/07(月) 13:43:47 ID:OjV3MtiG
:2008/07/05(土) 00:52:05 ID:sY2vTbpg
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2008/06/25(水) 13:23:00 ID:hh/tLn6V
:2008/06/25(水) 13:18:18 ID:hh/tLn6V
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254:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/07 14:28:37 OjV3MtiG
2008/07/07(月) 13:43:47 ID:OjV3MtiG
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255:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/07 14:31:35 OjV3MtiG
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256:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/07 14:33:35 OjV3MtiG
2008/07/07(月) 13:43:47 ID:OjV3MtiG
:2008/07/05(土) 00:52:05 ID:sY2vTbpg
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:2008/07/05(土) 00:44:10 ID:uLOosWa5
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2008/06/30(月) 14:14:52 ID:PqJ6NLxV
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2008/06/25(水) 13:23:00 ID:hh/tLn6V
:2008/06/25(水) 13:18:18 ID:hh/tLn6V
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257:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/07 15:09:53 OjV3MtiG
2008/07/07(月) 13:43:47 ID:OjV3MtiG
:2008/07/05(土) 00:52:05 ID:sY2vTbpg
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2008/07/05(土) 00:46:02 ID:uLOosWa5
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:2008/07/05(土) 00:44:10 ID:uLOosWa5
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2008/06/30(月) 14:14:52 ID:PqJ6NLxV
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2008/06/25(水) 13:23:00 ID:hh/tLn6V
:2008/06/25(水) 13:18:18 ID:hh/tLn6V
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258:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/07 15:20:41 OjV3MtiG
2008/07/07(月) 13:43:47 ID:OjV3MtiG
:2008/07/05(土) 00:52:05 ID:sY2vTbpg
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:2008/07/05(土) 00:44:10 ID:uLOosWa5
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2008/06/30(月) 14:14:52 ID:PqJ6NLxV
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2008/06/30(月) 14:13:58 ID:PqJ6NLxV
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2008/06/25(水) 13:23:00 ID:hh/tLn6V
:2008/06/25(水) 13:18:18 ID:hh/tLn6V
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259:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/07 15:39:41 OjV3MtiG
2008/07/07(月) 13:43:47 ID:OjV3MtiG
:2008/07/05(土) 00:52:05 ID:sY2vTbpg
2008/07/05(土) 00:51:43 ID:sY2vTbpg
2008/07/05(土) 00:46:02 ID:uLOosWa5
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:2008/07/05(土) 00:44:10 ID:uLOosWa5
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2008/07/05(土) 00:43:03 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/06/30(月) 14:14:52 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:14:25 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:13:58 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:13:23 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/25(水) 13:23:00 ID:hh/tLn6V
:2008/06/25(水) 13:18:18 ID:hh/tLn6V
2008/06/25(水) 13:16:38 ID:hh/tLn6V
/06/25(水) 13:10:17 ID:hh/tLn6V
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999


260:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/07 15:41:34 OjV3MtiG
2008/07/07(月) 13:43:47 ID:OjV3MtiG
:2008/07/05(土) 00:52:05 ID:sY2vTbpg
2008/07/05(土) 00:51:43 ID:sY2vTbpg
2008/07/05(土) 00:46:02 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/07/05(土) 00:45:31 ID:uLOosWa5
:2008/07/05(土) 00:44:10 ID:uLOosWa5
07/05(土) 00:43:26 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/07/05(土) 00:43:03 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/06/30(月) 14:14:52 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:14:25 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:13:58 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:13:23 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/25(水) 13:23:00 ID:hh/tLn6V
:2008/06/25(水) 13:18:18 ID:hh/tLn6V
2008/06/25(水) 13:16:38 ID:hh/tLn6V
/06/25(水) 13:10:17 ID:hh/tLn6V
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999


261:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/07 15:47:36 OjV3MtiG
2008/07/07(月) 13:43:47 ID:OjV3MtiG
:2008/07/05(土) 00:52:05 ID:sY2vTbpg
2008/07/05(土) 00:51:43 ID:sY2vTbpg
2008/07/05(土) 00:46:02 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/07/05(土) 00:45:31 ID:uLOosWa5
:2008/07/05(土) 00:44:10 ID:uLOosWa5
07/05(土) 00:43:26 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/07/05(土) 00:43:03 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/06/30(月) 14:14:52 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:14:25 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:13:58 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:13:23 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/25(水) 13:23:00 ID:hh/tLn6V
:2008/06/25(水) 13:18:18 ID:hh/tLn6V
2008/06/25(水) 13:16:38 ID:hh/tLn6V
/06/25(水) 13:10:17 ID:hh/tLn6V
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999


262:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/07 15:48:41 OjV3MtiG
2008/07/07(月) 13:43:47 ID:OjV3MtiG
:2008/07/05(土) 00:52:05 ID:sY2vTbpg
2008/07/05(土) 00:51:43 ID:sY2vTbpg
2008/07/05(土) 00:46:02 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/07/05(土) 00:45:31 ID:uLOosWa5
:2008/07/05(土) 00:44:10 ID:uLOosWa5
07/05(土) 00:43:26 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/07/05(土) 00:43:03 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/06/30(月) 14:14:52 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:14:25 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:13:58 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:13:23 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/25(水) 13:23:00 ID:hh/tLn6V
:2008/06/25(水) 13:18:18 ID:hh/tLn6V
2008/06/25(水) 13:16:38 ID:hh/tLn6V
/06/25(水) 13:10:17 ID:hh/tLn6V
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999


263:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/07 15:52:53 OjV3MtiG
2008/07/07(月) 13:43:47 ID:OjV3MtiG
:2008/07/05(土) 00:52:05 ID:sY2vTbpg
2008/07/05(土) 00:51:43 ID:sY2vTbpg
2008/07/05(土) 00:46:02 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/07/05(土) 00:45:31 ID:uLOosWa5
:2008/07/05(土) 00:44:10 ID:uLOosWa5
07/05(土) 00:43:26 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/07/05(土) 00:43:03 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/06/30(月) 14:14:52 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:14:25 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:13:58 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:13:23 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/25(水) 13:23:00 ID:hh/tLn6V
:2008/06/25(水) 13:18:18 ID:hh/tLn6V
2008/06/25(水) 13:16:38 ID:hh/tLn6V
/06/25(水) 13:10:17 ID:hh/tLn6V
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999


264:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/07 16:07:06 OjV3MtiG
2008/07/07(月) 13:43:47 ID:OjV3MtiG
:2008/07/05(土) 00:52:05 ID:sY2vTbpg
2008/07/05(土) 00:51:43 ID:sY2vTbpg
2008/07/05(土) 00:46:02 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/07/05(土) 00:45:31 ID:uLOosWa5
:2008/07/05(土) 00:44:10 ID:uLOosWa5
07/05(土) 00:43:26 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/07/05(土) 00:43:03 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/06/30(月) 14:14:52 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:14:25 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:13:58 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:13:23 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/25(水) 13:23:00 ID:hh/tLn6V
:2008/06/25(水) 13:18:18 ID:hh/tLn6V
2008/06/25(水) 13:16:38 ID:hh/tLn6V
/06/25(水) 13:10:17 ID:hh/tLn6V
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999


265:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/07 16:11:10 OjV3MtiG
2008/07/07(月) 13:43:47 ID:OjV3MtiG
:2008/07/05(土) 00:52:05 ID:sY2vTbpg
2008/07/05(土) 00:51:43 ID:sY2vTbpg
2008/07/05(土) 00:46:02 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/07/05(土) 00:45:31 ID:uLOosWa5
:2008/07/05(土) 00:44:10 ID:uLOosWa5
07/05(土) 00:43:26 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/07/05(土) 00:43:03 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/06/30(月) 14:14:52 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:14:25 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:13:58 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:13:23 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/25(水) 13:23:00 ID:hh/tLn6V
:2008/06/25(水) 13:18:18 ID:hh/tLn6V
2008/06/25(水) 13:16:38 ID:hh/tLn6V
/06/25(水) 13:10:17 ID:hh/tLn6V
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999


266:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/07 16:13:16 OjV3MtiG
2008/07/07(月) 13:43:47 ID:OjV3MtiG
:2008/07/05(土) 00:52:05 ID:sY2vTbpg
2008/07/05(土) 00:51:43 ID:sY2vTbpg
2008/07/05(土) 00:46:02 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/07/05(土) 00:45:31 ID:uLOosWa5
:2008/07/05(土) 00:44:10 ID:uLOosWa5
07/05(土) 00:43:26 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/07/05(土) 00:43:03 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/06/30(月) 14:14:52 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:14:25 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:13:58 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:13:23 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/25(水) 13:23:00 ID:hh/tLn6V
:2008/06/25(水) 13:18:18 ID:hh/tLn6V
2008/06/25(水) 13:16:38 ID:hh/tLn6V
/06/25(水) 13:10:17 ID:hh/tLn6V
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999


267:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/07 16:15:48 OjV3MtiG
2008/07/07(月) 13:43:47 ID:OjV3MtiG
:2008/07/05(土) 00:52:05 ID:sY2vTbpg
2008/07/05(土) 00:51:43 ID:sY2vTbpg
2008/07/05(土) 00:46:02 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/07/05(土) 00:45:31 ID:uLOosWa5
:2008/07/05(土) 00:44:10 ID:uLOosWa5
07/05(土) 00:43:26 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/07/05(土) 00:43:03 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/06/30(月) 14:14:52 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:14:25 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:13:58 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:13:23 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/25(水) 13:23:00 ID:hh/tLn6V
:2008/06/25(水) 13:18:18 ID:hh/tLn6V
2008/06/25(水) 13:16:38 ID:hh/tLn6V
/06/25(水) 13:10:17 ID:hh/tLn6V
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999


268:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/08 06:07:22 wjR+9SPa
>>243
天才現るwww

269:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/08 06:52:52 HIIHDK6k
ワロタw

270:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/08 06:57:50 CbXtjypn
>>244
流れ星はいつの時期からか急激に減ったよな。
まあ未だにたまに出くわすけど、頻度は減っている気がする。
選別するようになったのかね?

271:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/08 07:13:35 gOfVvWPU
URLリンク(dvd-r.jpn.org)
誘電LTH微妙杉・・・

272:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/08 07:31:19 HIIHDK6k
有機色素メディアって無機より製造コスト低いから安くできるはずなのに、
無機と同じ価格で明らかに劣る品質なら、積極的に選ぶ理由は無い
BD買うならパナかTDKの二択

273:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/09 06:26:18 JdqnIjHL
おととい買った誘電の16倍なんだがなんだか偏芯してるっぽい
回転し始めるとありえないぐらい振動するorz

これ、交換できるよね?


274:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/09 12:31:59 l8ZJfdcO
ドライブがヘボいだけじゃないのかね?

275:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/09 17:16:08 yMutf0zs
>>274
それが前に買った同じ16倍の誘電OEMのTDKでは全然振動しないんですよ
なんか明らかに別物
このまま使うとドライブ壊しそうなので、交換してもらってきます

276:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/09 18:11:16 YAOY1DuS
スピンドルはどうやって保管してる?
積み上げたままじゃ下の方に負担かかりそうだ

277:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/10 10:13:08 pa7vo5E9
スピンドルケースを積み重ねてるってことかい?
何十段も重ねなければ割れたりすることも無いでしょ。

278:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/10 16:35:12 u+Ahw9H6
>>277
いや、スピンドル状態で保管しておくと
積み重なってる下の方のDVD-Rは大丈夫かってこと

279:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/10 17:08:04 pa7vo5E9
>>278
そっちか。
両リブあった頃ならディスク重ねても平気だったろうけど、今のは片リブだからね。
ラベル貼ったりしなけりゃ重ねてもおkなんじゃないかな。

280:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/10 20:26:55 7j0trtPv
スピンドル状態で販売されているわけだから
ダメってことは無いんじゃないかな

281:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/10 20:43:44 Dw5KIRnX
あのぐらいの重さなら大丈夫じゃね

282:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/10 21:24:53 IAaV0+aT
日本ビクター株式会社は26日、7月1日付けで記録メディア事業を会社分割し、ビクターアドバンストメディア株式会社を新設。
その後、10月1日に新会社株式の65%を太陽誘電株式会社に譲渡すると発表した。
これによりビクターアドバンストメディアは太陽誘電の傘下に入ることになる。

ビクターは現在、新中期計画のもと、民生、エンタテインメント、プロシステムを基幹3事業と定め、その他事業について抜本的な見直しを実施。
事業構造と経営体質の改革に取り組んでおり、記録メディア事業については、事業譲渡や分社化を視野に入れた抜本的な改革を検討していたという。

その結果、株式の一部を太陽誘電へ譲渡することが、「事業継続に最適であり、当社がこれまで培ってきたブランド力・技術・ノウハウの最大限の活用、既存顧客への供給責任の継承
なおかつ記録メディア事業に従事する当社従業員の雇用確保にもつながると判断し、決議した」という。

太陽誘電側も、自身の記録メディア技術や生産ノウハウを、ビクターのブランド力や技術、ノウハウと融合させることで、「更なる事業基盤の強化を図る」としている。

新会社はビクター・JVCブランドのテープや光メディアの開発、製造、販売を継続する予定。
譲渡額は9月末の事業評価額をベースに決定し、現金による決済を予定している。
なお、2008年3月期のビクター、メディア事業の経営状況は、売上高が169億2,200万円、売上総利益が24億9,500万円、営業利益は23億2,500万円の赤字、経営利益も27億300万円のマイナスとなっている。



283:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/10 21:26:48 IAaV0+aT
日本ビクター株式会社は26日、7月1日付けで記録メディア事業を会社分割し、ビクターアドバンストメディア株式会社を新設。
その後、10月1日に新会社株式の65%を太陽誘電株式会社に譲渡すると発表した。
これによりビクターアドバンストメディアは太陽誘電の傘下に入ることになる。

ビクターは現在、新中期計画のもと、民生、エンタテインメント、プロシステムを基幹3事業と定め、その他事業について抜本的な見直しを実施。
事業構造と経営体質の改革に取り組んでおり、記録メディア事業については、事業譲渡や分社化を視野に入れた抜本的な改革を検討していたという。

その結果、株式の一部を太陽誘電へ譲渡することが、「事業継続に最適であり、当社がこれまで培ってきたブランド力・技術・ノウハウの最大限の活用、既存顧客への供給責任の継承
なおかつ記録メディア事業に従事する当社従業員の雇用確保にもつながると判断し、決議した」という。

太陽誘電側も、自身の記録メディア技術や生産ノウハウを、ビクターのブランド力や技術、ノウハウと融合させることで、「更なる事業基盤の強化を図る」としている。

新会社はビクター・JVCブランドのテープや光メディアの開発、製造、販売を継続する予定。
譲渡額は9月末の事業評価額をベースに決定し、現金による決済を予定している。
なお、2008年3月期のビクター、メディア事業の経営状況は、売上高が169億2,200万円、売上総利益が24億9,500万円、営業利益は23億2,500万円の赤字、経営利益も27億300万円のマイナスとなっている。



284:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/10 21:28:24 IAaV0+aT
日本ビクター株式会社は26日、7月1日付けで記録メディア事業を会社分割し、ビクターアドバンストメディア株式会社を新設。
その後、10月1日に新会社株式の65%を太陽誘電株式会社に譲渡すると発表した。
これによりビクターアドバンストメディアは太陽誘電の傘下に入ることになる。

ビクターは現在、新中期計画のもと、民生、エンタテインメント、プロシステムを基幹3事業と定め、その他事業について抜本的な見直しを実施。
事業構造と経営体質の改革に取り組んでおり、記録メディア事業については、事業譲渡や分社化を視野に入れた抜本的な改革を検討していたという。

その結果、株式の一部を太陽誘電へ譲渡することが、「事業継続に最適であり、当社がこれまで培ってきたブランド力・技術・ノウハウの最大限の活用、既存顧客への供給責任の継承
なおかつ記録メディア事業に従事する当社従業員の雇用確保にもつながると判断し、決議した」という。

太陽誘電側も、自身の記録メディア技術や生産ノウハウを、ビクターのブランド力や技術、ノウハウと融合させることで、「更なる事業基盤の強化を図る」としている。

新会社はビクター・JVCブランドのテープや光メディアの開発、製造、販売を継続する予定。
譲渡額は9月末の事業評価額をベースに決定し、現金による決済を予定している。
なお、2008年3月期のビクター、メディア事業の経営状況は、売上高が169億2,200万円、売上総利益が24億9,500万円、営業利益は23億2,500万円の赤字、経営利益も27億300万円のマイナスとなっている。



285:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/10 21:32:59 Co8/gTAm
何度もはるなよw

ビクターも日本製の誘電メディアになるなら大歓迎w

286:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/11 00:16:08 A7Vj1djc
荒らしてるキチガイだからスルー汁

287:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/11 19:55:15 zT2/stKM
>>278
下手に不織布なんかに入れて負荷かかる状態で保存するよりよっぽどマシってどっかで見た気がする。
ルーズリーフみたいなファイル式の不織布にファイリングして斜めった状態で数年保管して
見事に反り返ったR持ってる俺が言うから間違いないw

288:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/11 20:14:35 e6IlldL7
余程カビだらけの部屋なんだろうな

289:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/11 20:36:17 kHGh3AnT
今まで、いろんなメディア使って、エラーとか出る度にメディア変えて、
最後の砦として誘電に変えたんだが、誘電でも焼けなくなった人いる?

290:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/11 22:29:31 OPcTBOLU
>>288
湿気よりも、斜めに負荷がかかったのがいけないんじゃない?の

291:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/12 10:25:55 TeCX+8wG
5年程斜めで置いてるけど綺麗なもんだ

292:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/12 16:09:17 DSAVtLYJ
また書き込みでエラー頻出しだした。
3枚連続パーだ。
ドライブと相性悪いのか?
以前、エラー出まくったあと
50枚スピンドル買い直したら一枚失敗しただけで順調に焼けてたのに…。

293:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/13 00:24:18 MoFIGWM8
>>292
おまいの焼きドライブ環境は大丈夫なのか?
電源貧弱とかレーザー割れかけ(レーザーダイオードは熱を持つので、寿命がある)とか。

294:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/13 08:00:34 50MNMyP3
品質は落ちる所まで落ちてきたがエラーは出た事無いけどな

295:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/13 08:13:26 VSs6vJa1
ドライブ不良に1票

296:292
08/07/13 10:36:17 pEWu6E0O
無論真っ先に迷う事無くドライブ(東芝レコーダー)を疑ったんだが
失敗後、別の太陽誘電製スピンドルの
違う刻印No.のDVD-R使うと成功したんだよなぁ。
立て続けに失敗したのは同一のNo.が刻印。
どれも容量で先頭から16%の位置でエラーが出てる。
スピンドル内のタップリ残ってるディスク、全部同一の刻印だ…。

で、パイオニア製ドライブで使ってみたら成功した。
ドライブかよ!

と言い切れない何かひっかかるものがある…。
ドライブだけが原因のエラーなら
もっとランダムにミスしてもいいんじゃなかろうか?

297:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/13 11:24:27 MoFIGWM8
東芝レコーダー ・・・・・
(芝レコで語らない方がいいと思うぞ、ググってみ)

298:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/13 11:49:49 pEWu6E0O
ネット上の悪評はもともと承知してる。
ドライブも信用してないから対照実験できるようにメディア用意してるのねん。エラー頻度とその集中具合、出現パターンからして100%ドライブに起因するとも考えにくいんだよな…。
どちらも完璧は無いだろうから安全な組み合わせ見つけて回避するしかないんだが。
基本的には太陽誘電以外は使いたくない。

299:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/13 12:02:37 pEWu6E0O
う、また失敗の続いたスピンドルに戻ったらやはり失敗した。

AとB、2種類のスピンドルを用意。ともに太陽誘電製。
Aで連続3枚失敗→Bで一発成功→Aでまた失敗。

この状況だとAのディスクに原因を求めても仕方ないと思われる。

Aとパイオニアドライブ→成功。
こんな感じ。

300:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/13 12:18:32 WjSzo4lA
>>292
最近の誘電クォリティーは地雷源

50枚スピンドル買うと10%は焼き損じる覚悟が必要

301:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/13 12:30:30 pEWu6E0O
大雑把に考えて
東芝レコーダーの焼きパワー不足が
太陽誘電ディスクの些細な製造ムラを乗り越えることができない、って感じなのかな。
短期的コストではディスクとっ変えて焼き直して、
長期的にはデッキを買い替えろというとこか…。
お金かかるね。

302:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/13 12:44:02 egYhJbl4
波平なら、俺の隣で寝ているが?

303:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/13 12:57:54 lUYFvvTo
誘電で70枚近く焼いてるけど一度も失敗したことない

304:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/13 13:05:12 KLVERum5
>>302
マスオ乙

305:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/13 19:51:42 5ejsW+kR
ロットによる当たり外れはありそう。

306:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/13 19:57:03 50MNMyP3
東芝(笑

307:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/14 00:10:21 x7T/0yjg
新たにスピンドルCを用意して焼き。成功。
A三回連続失敗→B一発成功→A失敗→B成功→C三回連続成功

この状況でAを疑うのは自然だよな。
念のため使うの止めよう。
同一刻印、まだ20枚くらい残ってるぞ。

308:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/14 00:19:52 7JunY4c8
ダメロットはまとめて誘電に送ってやれ
今更代替品なんか要らんと思うかもしれないが、良品交換という目的だけじゃなく
不具合のある製品サンプルがメーカーに届くことの方が重要

まあ誘電ももうDVD-Rにはチカラ入れてないんで、送られたサンプルから不良原因の
解析なんてしないだろうけど

309:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/14 12:16:41 sNjP/nYn
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310:名無しさん◎書き込み中
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311:名無しさん◎書き込み中
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312:名無しさん◎書き込み中
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313:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/14 12:21:20 sNjP/nYn
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314:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/14 14:54:32 HQ4UUjjT
>>307
とりあえず販売元に電話して送り付けれw

315:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/15 16:50:06 O/W4Jw8e
2008/07/07(月) 13:43:47 ID:OjV3MtiG
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316:名無しさん◎書き込み中
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317:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/15 16:57:35 DzanbP7G
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318:名無しさん◎書き込み中
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9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
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319:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/15 16:58:45 DzanbP7G
2008/07/07(月) 13:43:47 ID:OjV3MtiG
:2008/07/05(土) 00:52:05 ID:sY2vTbpg
2008/07/05(土) 00:51:43 ID:sY2vTbpg
2008/07/05(土) 00:46:02 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/07/05(土) 00:45:31 ID:uLOosWa5
:2008/07/05(土) 00:44:10 ID:uLOosWa5
07/05(土) 00:43:26 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/07/05(土) 00:43:03 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/06/30(月) 14:14:52 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:14:25 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:13:58 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:13:23 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/25(水) 13:23:00 ID:hh/tLn6V
:2008/06/25(水) 13:18:18 ID:hh/tLn6V
2008/06/25(水) 13:16:38 ID:hh/tLn6V
/06/25(水) 13:10:17 ID:hh/tLn6V
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
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9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999


320:名無しさん◎書き込み中
08/07/15 16:59:53 O/W4Jw8e
2008/07/07(月) 13:43:47 ID:OjV3MtiG
:2008/07/05(土) 00:52:05 ID:sY2vTbpg
2008/07/05(土) 00:51:43 ID:sY2vTbpg
2008/07/05(土) 00:46:02 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/07/05(土) 00:45:31 ID:uLOosWa5
:2008/07/05(土) 00:44:10 ID:uLOosWa5
07/05(土) 00:43:26 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/07/05(土) 00:43:03 ID:uLOosWa5
2008/06/30(月) 14:14:52 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:14:25 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:13:58 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/30(月) 14:13:23 ID:PqJ6NLxV
2008/06/25(水) 13:23:00 ID:hh/tLn6V
:2008/06/25(水) 13:18:18 ID:hh/tLn6V
2008/06/25(水) 13:16:38 ID:hh/tLn6V
/06/25(水) 13:10:17 ID:hh/tLn6V
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
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999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999



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